What is "women's health"? Should it include issues related to transwomen? Should the name be changed to accomodate transmen?
Submitted June 23, 2020, 8:30 a.m. by calming-teaSee title.
151 comments recovered from the Pushshift database.
See title.
Welcome to GCDebatesQT! Please remember to keep all top-level comments as indicated for the target audience. Comments from users outside the target audience will be removed.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
Target audience is ALL - forgot to include it in the title
I think in certain instances it is kinder to specifically mention female trans people in womens health. For example, if a school know they have female trans students, saying 'girls and trans boys' is good.
This terminology is also useful if it ensures that all relevant people are made aware of campaigns - 'women and trans men' would be far more inclusive, be less offensive and be more effective than saying cervix havers, menstruators or bleeders.
But I find it difficult to believe that trans adults don't know which biological body they have and which health issues are applicable to them and which are not. I'm not convinced that abortion services need to be pressured into saying 'people who are pregnant' because a female trans person who has an unwanted pregnancy thinks that a clinic would not give them a termination because they identify as a man/male.
Male transpeople are not women and have absolutely no right to demand, expect or even ask that women's health is changed to accommodate their needs.
If they are genuinely confused, it just adds weight to the argument that they should not refer to themselves as tw, women or female and find other words to describe themselves.
I quite like this. I can understand treating children differently and that being one of the few cases where it is not worth arguing at all
I have to admit 'pregnant people' bothers me a lot for someone who never plans to have children and hates the idea of pregnancy.
My question would be: adult trans people know because they were nor shielded by biological facts growing up. How are trans children going to have a clear idea without it? Are you saying there should be a level of acceptance of gender identity among children and one for adults?
Second question, if a child does not have it super clear they are female/male - what are they transitioning from/to?
Anyone old enough to transition knows about sex and the differences between the sexes. As you say what is transition if not wanting to be seen as the other sex?
I'm not saying children, trans or otherwise should be shielded from the realities of sex, just kindness be shown to children. Especially female children with identity issues because its often used as a mask for other things.
Also, it's a bit of 'pick your battles'. I don't want children to avoid school because they feel excluded - that won't help anyone.
Do you think it's okay for TW to access female specific Healthcare where necessary? Eg. Mammography. Or if the only doc in your area capable of wielding a speculum is a gynecologist.
Some men have breast cancer and men may need to get mammograms.
It's not a strictly female service, although it may be necessary to be aware of individuals dignity and privacy.
Question for you. I'm aware that men get breast cancer, and that when they do it's often very serious. But why -- outside of a lump -- would a transwoman need a mammogram (referring to BloodyInkHeart's question).
Preventive mammograms are falling out of favor here, we're doing them less often. Do men/people with breast implants even need them?
In order :
No. It's not necessary ever. Mammography is not female specific. Men can get breast cancer. Don't be sexist.
Every doctor can "wield" a speculum. You could do it yourself. The surgeon who made the hole is the one who should be giving care tips. Not a gyno who has no idea. Neovagina are not muscle like a real vagina. They can be opened with two. Fingers if desired. A speculum is there because of the H shape of a vagina that needs to be pressed open since the default is flat and closed.
So much this!
I'm courius. Have you ever tried that? Spreading a neovagina with just two fingers? Because it sounds like you did. And if you did was it enough to actually examine the tissue inside?
Unfortunately yes. I was in a situation where I had been pressured into trying to have sex, but ultimately I could not go through with it. It was just... Wrong. And not attractive. It extremely obvious it's not a vulva or vagina. I did not do the touching but he...opened it. It was just. Like as an adult you can do what you want with your body but there is literally no way anyone would ever mistake that for a vagina.
I'm sorry you had to go through that shit. I know it's not worth anything.
So she could do it whith just two fingers?
Question for QT:
Why do you suppose questions like OP's are not about Men's Health with anything approaching the frequency that Women's Health is debated?
sorry i’m not QT, but i’ve not really seen the term “men’s health” used. i suspect this is because men’s heath is considered default healthcare. so i would suspect there is less push back because the term is uncommon.
Swing and a miss. Women are medicalized and men aren't. So if transwomen want to be women, they need to medicalize themselves. They need to invade women's medical spaces, just like they invade women's restrooms and lockerrooms and slumber parties. Because if they don't push their way in, they can't prove to themselves and the world that they really are "women". Even though they're male. And unwanted.
Transmen, who are socialized as girls/women, just don't do that pushy, aggressive shit.
sorry, did you mean to reply to my comment?
i don’t see how your response is relevant at all to mine.
women are considered “other” by society, so we have a separate concept of “women’s health”. men are the default in this society, so “men’s health” is not as commonly used. i work in a healthcare adjacent field, and i commonly hear of “women’s health” to refer to ob/gyn services, but i never hear “men’s health”—they just use the term urologist instead.
i don’t see how that has anything to do with slumber parties.
Women and men go to all the same doctors normally, plus women go to a gynecologist for "women's health" because women and women's bodies are much more medicalized than men's. It's surprising that you don't know this, given that you work in a "healthcare adjacent" field. Urology/proctology is not considered "well man's" healthcare. It's something a man does when there's an issue.
Have a nice evening. Btw, downvoting is against sub rules.
aren’t you making the same point as i am then, that “men’s health” as a concept does not exist? what exactly do you mean that “women’s bodies are more medicalized”? that they require more medical care?
sorry, i didn’t downvote you, but good to know regarding the rules. i’m surprised as i’ve certainly seen comments with negative votes in the past.
Womens Health is relevant only as it applies to.... womens health. Which means that yes, it needs to accommodate trans men. It does not, under ANY circumstances, have ANYTHING to do with trans women. Even concerning hormones, trans women take very specific hormones at very specific levels that are constant all the time, and this only allows them to produce female secondary sex characteristics and is no way even close to being similar to the constantly fluctuating multi-hormones that women produce. So any issues there are not the responsibility of womens health, but of endocrinology.
I believe it would be massively beneficial to both trans men and trans women if, instead of forcing a tiny percentage of people to change healthcare for more than half of the world's population, we find a way to set up trans specific institutions of health care. Or better yet, just keep the gender clinics we ALREADY have well funded.
I initially though of the aspect of transmen in terms of the name - like people who find 'pregnant women' offensive - then is 'women's health' offensive too?
But you raise a good point - should it include specific issues related to transmen? As you say, specific issues related to taking hormones in a pattern shared among transmen?
I agree that it would be more useful to consider trans issues as 'trans health'
I believe a lot of the backlash from people regarding wording comes from a place of emotion, but in strictly scientific spaces, no one is referring to pregnant women as "people who can get pregnant". Socially, however, it is an issue. You're right. And that's why I think trans specific healthcare is SO important as an entity on it's own. I like the term you used, "trans health". I think it would eliminate some of the stigma trans people face in the medical world, and it would help them get better and more individualized care.
And yeah, on the issue of trans men and hormones, unfortunately it cant really fall under womens health because testosterone levels exceed those found in women naturally, even accounting for PCOS, and also never fluctuate like they do naturally in natal men. So once again I'd say that trans specific care is desperately needed. It would only benefit both trans individuals as well as healthcare providers. Imagine a future where someone could spend their graduate years, internships, residencies, and all further medical training specializing only in trans health care?
Healthcare is also getting more and more individualized in general - a lot of genetic research is doing so
I think it is to be expected that a lot of women are not going to like 'pregnant people', because pregnancy has been a women's issue since forever.
I find it interesting that i have not seen people challenging the label 'women's health' the same way 'pregnant people' has been advocated. It sounds odd to talk about pregnant people under the label of women's health. Why is one fine but the other is not?
I took a step back once i found myself repeating in dozens of comments that i don't have an issue with trans spaces, i just want women to have their own spaces & to not ignore biology. Transwomen can have trans health and transwomen health, but should not demand to be included in the label of women's health. They are obviously going to have to look at men's health for a lot of things. Same for transmen - with the added political/medical layer for some issues (such as abortion where they are going to benefit from feminism as females)
Trans health is a great idea, and there will always be a need for specialists. But do you think there will ever be a need -- outside the largest cities -- for trans health specialists? These people need to be able to see enough patients to make a living :)
True true about them needing to make a living. But when you look at SRS surgeons, there are always only a handful of names that constantly pop up, so maybe if there were greater opportunities for specialization, there may be more demand. And when you look at several very rare diseases and disorders, there are still always medical professionals that specialize in treating them. I believe that if we expanded trans specific healthcare as its own division, we'd see a lot of need for such practices.
Oh and edit: outside of major cities? Probably not unfortunately :/
If someone finds the term "pregnant women" offensive, that is their problem to deal with. Women's health is not offensive. Trans men need to accept that with their choice to transition comes some personal responsibility. Accept that women's health centers are for female humans, which they are, and simply ask the doctors to use your preferred name. They still need women's Healthcare, and we should not have to change the way that women speak about their bodies because a few are not able to be emotionally stable enough to accept their biological reality.
You're wrong. Women's health isn't just about pregnancy and hormones.
https://medlineplus.gov/ency/article/007458.htm
You're the only person forcing anything. If a trans-women wants to join women's health then they should because they're women.
Name one benefit womens health has for trans women. A higher breast cancer rate due to gynecomastia doesnt count.
But sure, trans women are women and Rachel Dolezal is black lmaoooo
Read the link.
I did. Hence my comment about men growing breast tissue. STD tests for penises, whether they are on the inside or outside is still MENS health. Cosmetic surgery is not womens health. Urinary issues for an individual with a vas deferens, prostate, bulbous urethral gland etc are still mens health.
Did you even read it? Again I ask, name ONE benefit a biological man can receive from womens health services.
I said STI not STD, which affects all genders.
Did you miss Heart disease or Osteoporosis?
'women's health' is not a club where girls meet up and have pillow fights.
I think they forgot to send me the card to join the group! Really, what does it even mean?
What it is about? And why should it include transwomen?
Last time I checked, they were not adult human females.
Sorr, i'm posting on another acc.
They literally are though. That's why they're called trans-women.
Please bring up your points for why they aren't female and I'll slam that shit down.
Okay, they are not female. The female sex is the sex which is catered to making large gametes. They usually have XX chromosomes and a lack of an SRY gene. Even if they have XY chromosomes, they lack an SRY gene or an SRY gene is not fully functional.
What does that have to do with what I said? Chromsomes are just chomosomes. Society saw that most women had XY and then we put those people into a group. We made label and we can bend the label as we learn more about sex and gender. You people act like these labels are a law of nature like gravity.
u/littlerbear
Got it.
Really? With the surgically altered penises? Know who has a surgically altered penis? A man. Or, if they've gotten a functional hole lined with tilapia - also not a vagina. Or maybe they got the functional hole lined with lower intestine? Also not a vagina. Or wait: maybe they got the one that's lined with scrotal tissue and grows hair. Hmmm....wait...that's not a vagina either. Since GYNs are trained to work with women's reproductive systems, men-who-identify-as-women have no reason to go to a GYN's office.
Born male, live male, die male. To quote another GC commenter, sex at birth is sex for life.
Also, no one's impressed by your 'slam that shit down' BS. Bluster is no substitute for facts here. And whatever pseudoscientific balderdash you trot out, you know, I know, everyone knows: reality is not on the side of men-who-identify-as-women when those men claim to be actual women. You don't have the chromosomes, you don't have the reproductive system, you don't even have the socialization. All you have is some fantasy of yourself as a woman that you expect the world to kow-tow to. It won't happen here.
Since when is a surgically altered penis anything close to a vagina? Do I need to post an article or two about how different the SAP is from a vagina? Do we really have to go there?
Adult (adjective) human (noun) female (adjective) = woman (noun for the previous category of biological people). We see this in most animals: adult (ad) bovine (noun) female (ad) = cow or heifer (noun for the previous category). Adult female chicken = hen. Adult female pig = sow. Adult female cat = queen. Adult female rabbit = jill. Chimpanzee = empress. None of the nouns that describe adult female animals are based on how they feel. They are specific words to abbreviate the biological category of adult female animal. Women are adult human females, regardless of how we feel, regardless of what our personal religion or mental health problem is, regardless of whether or not we feel we conform to the social constructs of the gender role ascribed to that noun category, we still are. Women's health is the health for biologically adult human females. Words have meanings, despite some people being offended by them. It includes transmen. There's no reason to have medical care relating to the two biological sexes be joined, especially when women's health has been so traditionally ignored by science for the default human male.
Men's health (or simply medicine) should continue to include transwomen because they are adult human males.
Women's health as it pertains to biological sex has to remain about those who are biological women. Even access to health and the treatment types administered needs to remain relevant to biological women, or the implications in medicine could be damaging to women. As much as trans men hate to hear it, this must include them as well, as there are some health issues that only pertain to biological females.
Do transwomen need help to
No they dont. Case closed.
Uhhh. I don't think many will, but a couple seem to want to try
I agree with all your points!
Which is unfortunate because there are no long term studies on the safety of artificially inducing milk production in men and whether it is as safe or healthy for a baby to do so.
It can't possibly be, all those hormones.
It's clear from other so many other medications that even if we don't have to worry about short term effects, there are always long term. And we won't know about those for years, decades even.
There are all kinds of studies being done on kids conceived with donor sperm and eggs, and/or carried by surrogates. Researchers are finding the kids have much higher anxiety than kids conceived naturally, and so on.
Really? I'm not denying, I'm interested in those studies because its kinda sad. Poor babies. Do you have any papers on that?
Nah, I do this research for interest, not work, so I don't save links. (Also, I'm kind of disorganized.) Sorry :)
Mic drop.
Your comment seems pretty dishonest. Not all cis women can get pregnate. There's more to Women's health than just pregnancy and dealing with your vagina. There's Heart disease, Hormone therapy, Osteoporosis, Breast cancer, Sexual Health, STI, etc. People on here seem to fixated on gate-keeping.
But these problems are exclusive to women. No men will ever have to go through those problems.
Hormmone therapy, Heart disease, STI, and Osteoporosis are exclusive to women?
I'm talking about the problems listed above.
The problems I listed are also part of women's health. Not all cis women are able to get pregant either so should they not be allowed to be women?
Women are more likely to have osteoporosis than men, actually, and to have more severe cases of it, but it's not an issue that one would need to see a GYN for. Hormone therapy, to treat menopausal and postmenopausal symptoms, sure, but women can also see a GP for that. My brother-in-law had prostate cancer, so he's talking hormones but he's seeing an oncologist and an endocrinologist for that. Heart-disease is definitely not exclusive to women, but the symptoms can be different. As for STIs, those have to do with vaginas, so a GYN would be the go-to for women.
The point is, women have specific health needs that men-who-identify-as-women don't have. One's hunger for validation does not change facts or determine courses of study for medical professionals.
As someone who has awful views of pregnancy and would never ever carry a child - yes, those are the first things i will say when thinking about women's health
I might never need it, but other people like me (ie women) might.
Abortion is my top issue and it is not about being exclusionary. You can care about an issue if it will never affect you. How is it gatekeeping? Itis funny how these things were never an issue before transwomen came along..
None of which affects transwomen in the same way as women. I am not sure what your point is...
Heart disease, hormone therapy, osteoporosis, cancer etc...also apply to men. So they are not "womens health" but adults health. Or regular health ot whatever.
But things like periods, menopause, ovarian cancer, etc apply to all women. Not just fertile ones.
Yes, it is. Who are you to say they aren't? Just because it applies to men doesn't mean women deal with it in the same context.
So why should men be in women's health if they deal with it in different contexts. A transwoman in biologically male, which means it would affect them in a male way, so why should they be included in women's health.
Lmao. Hormone therapy, sexual health, STIs are directly related to the health of one's vagina. Gyns also do breast exams for cancer and write orders for mammograms.
So, that leaves heart disease and osteoporosis. If I were worried about either, I'd go seen an internist.
You have got to be a dude. You dudes have to stop talking about women's healthcare because you're so damned ignorant you just make fools of yourselves and waste our time.
I feel like women’s health on average will not apply to the vast majority of trans woman health needs. Now after vaginoplasty, typically OBGYNs are the specialty that see trans women and they are often found in centers that are described as offering women’s health. To me it is very appropriate for trans women to seek care in this setting.
The challenge of the invalidation of trans men that occurs when OBGYN services that they need access too are referred to as “women’s” health is noteworthy. It is pretty well described that trans men often avoid routine screening such as mammography and Pap smears due to the experience of being invalidated in a medical setting. I do think centers that offer these services should consider offering them in a gender neutral manner so as to create a welcoming environment for trans men
Edit: thanks for downvoting me in a debate sub because you disagree!
Do you think it is an automatic balance between including 'men' and not excluding 'women'?
A hunch i have is that this might be a common trend among dysphoric people or people who have issues with body image. Has this been investigated?
Why would a trans woman need an gynecologist? Their surgically altered genitals do not suddenly begin functioning like a vagina and they do not have ovaries or a uterus or a cervix. It is a cavity that is made of skin. So what is the gynecologist doing for them? They do not need pap smears or any other service. Gynecologists are generally not plastic surgeons and don't have the expertise needed to give direction on healing or maintaining plastic surgery.
That’s just the way it is! Everyone I’ve know who has had a vaginoplasty saw their surgeon for one year then was referred to a gynecologist for routine care or concerns after that.
Gynecologists are skilled at using a speculum and can access the canal to visualize any areas of concern. Like if your neovagina is hurting or bleeding when it shouldn’t be you want to see someone who is the best at looking in there and seeing what’s what.
So whether GC feels invalidated or not by trans women seeing gynecologists, that is currently how it is and honestly makes a world of sense.
Like if your surgically altered penis is bleeding you should see the doctor who did that to you.
What is a gyno supposed to do for that? If a woman is bleeding abnormally we have ways to figure out what's wrong.
Your weeping surgical wound needs to be handled by a professional that deals with that. It is not a vagina and does not have the processes associated with a vagina. What does an ob recommend for a bleeding vaginoplasty?
Edit no woman feels fucking invalidated by a trans woman swing a gyno. They feel incredulous just like the gyno does.. She doesn't want to get fired for being a bigot. There's no reason for anyone with vaginoplasty to see a gynecologist. They don't have a vagina or a cervix or mucus membranes or a uterus or ovaries or any of that.
Usually a speculum exam, look for the tear, offer reassurance. Some family medicine docs who see a lot of trans folks can do it too, it’s just obgyns tend to be more commonly referred to. I’m just saying how things are. You are purposefully describing trans bodies in an inflammatory way. “Surgically altered penis”, “weeping surgical wound”. What’s hard about using the term all medical professionals use. Oh, that’s right, you wouldn’t be able to be transphobic
A neo vagina is a surgical issue. It is not a vagina. It is not transphobic to say that bleeding from said surgery is weeping. I had surgery on my hip and it was described as so.
Surgically altered penis and neo vagina mean the same thing. If you need a different word for your sensitivity I can say neovagina but it is in no way an actual vagina.
So an ob gyn can use a speculum to look inside a body cavity and this needs to be done by them why? Every doctor knows how to use that tool. Every one. You could do it yourself. It's not complicated.
And what would they see? A dry cavern of skin. Why does an ob need to see that or look at it? It's not necessary. The parts are not there. They spend a lot of time and money to specialize in those parts and trans women do not have them.
Also your "transphobic" nonsense has no power here. I am not afraid of trans people. In fact I support and defend trans men because they are women. You can't simply whine transphobic and expect women to cower and cater to you. I'm not afraid of trans people because they are trans. I am confident that trans men are not going to rape and assault me.
I am not transphobic in the least. I am afraid of males.
So what is the functional hole made from? Colon tissue is not vaginal tissue; fish skin is not vaginal tissue, arm or thigh skin is not vaginal tissue, scrotal tissue is no vaginal tissue, neither is penile tissue. Are surgeons using anything else to line the functional hole yet? One thing the functional hole is lined not lined with: vaginal tissue. So, what should we call it? Surgically altered penis works fine for me, or should we label it according to what it's made out of? You might experience that as more inflammatory than surgically altered penis.
Any doctor can use a speculum to look inside a hole. They do it all the time in surgery.
What's what? What could there possibly be that is in a gynecologists purview?
Have you used a speculum to look “in a hole”? Usually practitioners who do a lot of women’s health are the most proficient. It’s not something all doctors do regularly. Even less common is experiencing with diagnosing damage to or a suspicious lesion on a neovaginal lining.
Why would they need to? They already know it is not a vagina problem.
It is a bleeding or surgical oriblem which needs to be seen by a surgeon or practice that deals with plastic surgery.
A gynecologist is not equipped to make a treatment plan for someone who does not have a vagina.
Any suspicious lesion in a neo vagina has nothing to do with an actual vagina. That would be for a dermatologist.
Why couldn't a urologist do that? Or a GP? I know it's not a uwu as seeing a gyno, but men-who-idenitify-as-women are probably better off going to someone who knows how to deal with the male urinary/reproductive system, however surgically altered it may be.
This sounds like BS. I can imagine that men-who-identify-as-women would feel validated by seeing a gynecologist but since GYNs don't treat surgically altered penises, or functional holes lined with various substances, I can't imagine what a man-who-identifies-as-a-woman would need a GYN for. They don't have ovaries, cervixes, uteri, fallopian tubes, they're not dealing with menopause or peri-menopause...what need would they have to take time away from actual women?
GPs can't do this? Or any other doc with access to a speculum? Or an MRI? Or a urologist?
See my comment above. I know the fantasy is that the surgically altered penis and the functional hole is the same as a vagina, but it isn't. There are profound differences in anatomy and microflora, and I have a hard time believing that any GYN who's ethical, or who wants to avoid a malpractice suit, would be extremely hesitant about treating men-who-identify-as-women.
This is hilarious. Women don't need validation from men-who-identify-as-women. We do need access to women's health care, however. Something that men-who-identify-as-women will never need.
But that's gynaecologists offering additional services to male people, it's not 'women's health'.
Mammograms and smears aren't fun, and lots of women don't have them because of fear, pain, past trauma, not having the time...
I understand why lots of women/females don't have screening that they know they would benefit from.
The problem with rebranding 'women's health' as anything else, is that there's a danger that more women will be put off attending clinics than the number of trans men that would start attending such services.
Are there really that many trans men not attending clinics they would otherwise attend because they are branded as 'women health'?
This guide from the Trans Care Project says that minor complications can be taken care of by a GP but everything else must be handled by the surgeon. Nothing about seeing a gyn.
GP, gyn, or surgeon are okay choices but key is finding someone who is experienced in evaluating the area and treating the issue. Not all GPs, Gyns, or surgeons are.
I suspect that very very gynecologists are experienced in evaluating the area and treating the issue.
I’d imagine there would be more gynecologists comfortable with doing so than GPs or surgeons
If the surgeon who created my neovagina is not comfortable dealing with complications from it, then I went to a bad surgeon.
Also, the fact that you produced a case study showing one time a gynecologist was involved in a trans woman’s care, does not mean that it is in fact standard practice or that gynecologists would like to take time away from practicing actual gynecology to do it.
And I didn’t downvote any of your comments, but the reason others did is because you keep asserting factually questionable statements. Not because they don’t like your opinion.
GYNs aren't necessarily surgeons, and probably don't have the training to treat issues with a surgically altered penis, because it's a penis, not a vagina, which is the specialty of GYNs. Or, if the man in question is having a problem with the functional hole in his crotch that's lined either with tilapia, color or thigh skin, again, the GYN in question more than likely doesn't have the skill or the knowledge to treat the issue. Vaginas aren't made of colon, tilapia, harvested skin, penis or scrotal tissue.
GYNs are trained to work with women, not with men posing as women.
Women's health has to do with the biological, physiological processes that are specific to adult female humans or female children.
No trans woman will ever need a gynecologist or an obstetrician for any reason, as they will never have a vagina, vulva, uterus, ovaries, female endocrine system, etc. Genital surgery and such should be handled and seen by the plastic surgeon's care team who did the operation. A surgically altered penis does not become a vagina and therefore is outside of the expertise of an ob/gyn, and needs specialized care specific to that medical concern.
Trans men will need gynecological care and could even need obstetrics. If they still have ovaries, a uterus, fallopian tubes, a vagina, vulva, etc then they need these services. But they also need to realize that these services are there for their biological sex needs. If you transition, it should be your responsibility to handle your dysphoria with the help of a therapist or other means. Thee is no need to take women out of the equation. Trans men know they are biological women and vice versa for trans women.
The only thing I can think of would be mammography, but that is not even female specific, as men can get breast cancer too, and this is a known fact. The "women's health" aspect here is more socially directed at urging women to stay up to date with their breast health. If male people would like to have more attention in this regard, they should fight for it on their own time and terms and not disrupt any women's health directives to make it about them.
Hormone issues should be managed by the doctor or endocrinologist that prescribed them and monitored them. That is outside of the realm of expertise for an ob/gyn and as such should not be treated or managed by them as it is not within their purview.
If trans people would like trans specific Healthcare, they are welcome to solicit funds and/or privately fund trans health clinics, so long as it does not impede or take away from existing clinics and their funding. This is what women had to do in order to take control of their health, and as such it is not our responsibility to cater to another category that is outside of that realm. It needs its own specialized care.
This is beautifully put.
This put into words what i was feeling. I don't want to exclude transmen because they are female and they will need those services. But i don't think using female words (e.g. woman) is exclusionary. If it makes you uncomfortable, well, you gotta deal with it on your own.
It is maybe like common triggers. I will put a TW for a detailed description of violence, but not fod a popping baloon.
Indeed. Trans men are female and I will fight for and defend them because they are. We fought too hard for our gains to be taken down by the likes of those who would erase what woman means.
Even if you want to identify out, the reality still exists that you need specific Healthcare.
And with triggers... Like you should know if you are going to a women's clinic for female Healthcare that you may be triggered. I am triggered by some stuff but I still go in because I have to. I just deal with it. Like trans men should.
i'm sorry if i misunderstand you but can you clarify what you mean by "Trans men are female"? i don't want to call you transphobic i just want to understand what you're saying
Sure, not to worry, it's not transphobic at all so you don't have to worry about that.
Trans men are people who are biologically female but who wish for society to see them as men, and as such, they outwardly display stereotypically masculine traits such as "men's" clothing, shorter hair, some grow facial hair with testosterone, and some bind or remove their breasts, etc.
Just like trans women are male, trans men are female. This is not a transphobic concept and it's kind of odd you would bring that up, but if you are just trying to learn then I appreciate the question.
ah okay!
i understand what you mean
the wording just confused me a bit
My OB/gyn has a place on the initial forms to indicate your preferred pronouns. I was pleased to see that as I felt it was inclusive for trans men who may feel uncomfortable seeking services.
Women’s health refers to the medical health of female humans (girls included bc a lot of it starts at puberty). This ranges from issues relating to the reproductive system itself to how females may experience certain health issues differently (e.g. ADHD and heart attacks both tend to present differently in females and males).
No.
No.
There should be men’s health, women’s health, trans men’s health, and trans women’s health.